Kyiv, Ukraine(CNN) Two former fighters of the Russian private military company Wagner told CNN of their horrific experiences on the battlefield in eastern Ukraine, and how anyone who failed was immediately shot by their own commanders.
The two fighters were captured by Ukrainian forces late last year. CNN is not disclosing their identities for their own safety. Both are married with children and were recruited while in prison. One is serving a 20-year sentence for manslaughter.
For security reasons, the Ukrainians hid their presence in the room where the interview took place. CNN told the fighters they could end the interview at any time they wanted. But they spoke in detail for more than an hour.
Both fighters spoke of horrific losses in “first wave” attacks reminiscent of World War I cases.
“There were 90 of us. Sixty died in the first attack, killed by mortar fire. A few remained wounded,” said one, recalling his first attack near the village of Bilohorivka. “If one group is unsuccessful, another will be sent immediately. If the second is unsuccessful, they will send another group.”
Another fighter was involved in an attack that lasted five days, through the forest near the city of Lysychansk on the Luhansk-Donetsk border in eastern Ukraine.
“The first steps into the forest were difficult because of all the landmines that were spread. Of the 10 men, seven died instantly,” he said.
“You can’t help the wounded. The Ukrainians are firing heavily at us, so even though their injuries are minor, you have to move on, otherwise you’ll be hit by fire.
“You are in this for five days, people dying next to me, praying to God, asking for water. You think you can put your weapon down and nothing else happens. And then the fight start again 10 minutes later, and [the Ukrainians] keep following you. There is no feeling attached to it. Just wave.”
“Four hundred [Wagner fighters] brought there, and then more and more, all the time.”
The prisoner said an instinct of self-preservation kicked in for him, but the rest froze. “Some stop right in the forest and drop their weapons. But to drop your weapons is to come under sniper fire and die.”
There was no evacuation of the injured, he added. “If you are injured, you turn yourself first, in any way you can, to a neutral place where there is no fire, and if there is no one around, you give first aid to your self,” he said.
Casualties piled up in the dozens, the men said. “When the casualties arrive, you get orders to load them, and you don’t think about who is dead and who is wounded,” one of the fighters said.
During their many weeks on the front lines, both men said they had only one instinct.
“Just to live. I just want to live, no matter the cost,” said the prisoner involved in the attack in the forest.
They were horrified by the casualties and the killing of the Ukrainian soldiers they faced. “You think you feel something [after killing someone]but no, just keep going.”
The alternative of walking through the mines toward the Ukrainian artillery was just as deadly, according to the men’s accounts.
“We cannot retreat without an order because if we don’t obey the order, we will be killed,” said one of the prisoners.
“One man remained in one position, he was really scared, this was his first attack. We received an order to run forward. But the man hid under a tree and refused. took 50 meters the distance from the base. He dug his own grave and then was shot.”
Another fighter reported a similar situation: “Our commander was told that if someone has cold feet, he must be eliminated.
The promise of freedom
Both men described how Wagner recruited them. In August and September of last year, the head of the group, Yevgeny Prigozhin, arrived by helicopter at the prisons where they were held, offering a six-month contract in exchange for a pardon.
One of the men has another 10 years in prison ahead of him after a manslaughter conviction.
“I consider that six months is better than the 10 or 11 years I could be in prison… I just want a new start in life,” he said.
At that time, Prigozhin’s recruitment campaign in Russian prisons was in full swing. Western intelligence officials and prison advocacy groups estimate that between 40,000 and 50,000 men were recruited.
On Thursday, Prigozhin said the recruitment drive in the prison had ended but to no avail.
“Only a handful of my unit came for money, most came because they had a long sentence,” said one of the fighters. “But there are also some who have 12 days left on their sentence, and they still go.
“They lined up everyone in the yard and Prigozhin started recruiting people,” he said. “[Prigozhin] said he has the authority from higher bodies to get anyone out of prison, regardless of the crimes or the prison term. The ideal candidates are murderers, robbers.”
The selection process is so young that older prisoners only have to show they can walk a few yards, one of the prisoners said. “They took almost everything.”
“Some of them are head cases … the crazy ones, the ones when they get the weapon in their hands they don’t know how to handle it,” he added.
For inmates with years of service, the offer is tempting.
One of the prisoners said: “For our freedom we had to fight for six months in Ukraine, to fight the Nazis. At the same time, he promised us wages, payment of debts, and a pure history.”
Russian President Vladimir Putin has repeatedly pushed the baseless rhetoric of “denazification” as justification for his invasion of Ukraine.
Shortly after Prigozhin’s visits, hundreds of prisoners were taken by bus and plane to a training ground in Russia’s Rostov region, according to the two men.
There is a strict ban on drugs and alcohol, one of the inmates said. Some of the commanders said they fought for Wagner in Africa and Syria.
The training was short and basic – handling the guns for the terrible attacks that were soon ordered to be carried out. The men said it was clear they were being groomed for missions they would not sign up for.
Now they are bitter about the tricks of Prigozhin’s sales pitch.
“He’s not talking about danger,” said one. “He mentioned the removal of all convictions, we will serve six months, all convictions will be erased, an advance payment of 240,000 rubles (about $3,300) and also that our role is to hold the defense in the second line.”
Both men also felt misled about the nature of the conflict.
“We thought we were going to fight Poles and various mercenaries. Germans. We didn’t think there was anything left of the Ukrainian army there. We thought they had left the country,” said one.
“So it became clear that they were just spinning lies so that we could go to war with the Ukrainians. No one thought that the AFU [Armed Forces of Ukraine] really fight for their own country, for their loved ones. We only know this after entering there. “
It was almost a relief to be caught, the prisoners said.
One said he and a wounded comrade were the only survivors of his group, caught “between two Ukrainian mortars and a sniper.”
“The order told me to dig in my position, so I dug in my position, waiting for the evacuation. They sent a group of 10, and the sniper eliminated all 10,” he recalled.
“Then the command told us on the walkie-talkie: Get out any way you can, you’re on your own.”
It was then, he said, that Ukrainian soldiers “came up and fired at my feet, said ‘hands up,’ and that was it.”
When asked if they would make the same decision again, the prisoners paused for a moment.
“I think it was the wrong choice… I never participated in any military operation, especially the fight against the AFU, which refused to give up its land. They brought us here under the mistake excuse. And that’s why we are at war, but I don’t think it’s a reasonable reason,” said one.
Another inmate agreed. “I don’t think it’s worth it. Now I hope I can turn over a new leaf.”
He said that he has been able to reach his family since he was in prison.
“They thought I was dead, until I contacted them. They were crying and surprised I was alive.”
Both men said they wanted to return to Russia.
One said, “I have nothing to do with Russia, but I just want to go home.”