Liverpool fans don’t think Arne Slot is a ‘Messiah’ or even a very naughty boy. But things are going okay.
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It’s the players, stupid
Just a quick response to the number of mails pointing out that Liverpool are unlikely to push for the title with a new manager – Slot has done this all before and besides, there are still lots of members of that squad – Yer Virgils, yer Allisons, yer Trents, Yer Mos – who have been and done it, got the medals, won some, lost more, but still, they know what it’s like. Slot hasn’t changed much from Klopp – which is why he’s done so well. No need to strip the engine. Just a fresh paint of coat.
You only have to look at the way in which peak Chelsea seemed to change managers every five minutes but cos they had the nucleus of a multi-title winning squad were able to win and win and win – even with the likes of Di Matteo (no offense, Roberto) in charge.
I would say that if Pep left tomorrow and Hodgson took over (again, no offense Roy) they would still go on and win multiple pots. It’s all about the Players. We seem to have spent months debating what has gone wrong with Manchester United, why no manager seems to succeed there without highlighting just how scattergun and terrible their player recruitment has been.
In this day and age, coaches and managers come and go all the time. We are in the age of the player.
Dan, London
Liverpool fans not getting carried away at all
I’m not sure which Liverpool fans Garey Vance is talking about when he accuses them of triumphalism. Most of the ones I talk to are quite cautious about how well Slot’s doing, and agree with the manager that the big tests for the team are still to come.
However, I’m broadly optimistic because they’re winning matches, and, while it is still early days, Liverpool fans can be broadly happy with how the transition from Klopp to Slot is going.
I understand how, as a Manchester United fan, this might not be particularly familiar to Garey any more, but “being quite pleased about the football team they support winning football matches” should still be a reasonably straightforward concept to grasp. Even for an imaginary poster.
Dara O’Reilly, London
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…I expect there will probably be 427 responses sent in to Garey Vance’s mailbox entry from this morning but I thought I’d throw my two penneth in.
Firstly, if I’m being totally honest, I’m not hearing any serious title talk or Messiah hailing from fans and wonder if Mr Vance has cheekily constructed a little straw man here. Fans are pleased with results of course but performances over 90 mins could be better.
It’s true, we have only dominated in patches, a second half here or 20-30 min spell there, but ultimately it’s a results business and it’s objectively better to win, for arguments sake, a stodgy non-event of a 1-0 v Crystal Palace than it is to draw 0-0 and desperately scramble for signs of improvement from a failing manager and misfiring squad.
More that that though, there is no crowing that Slot is on a par with, or superior to, Klopp because it’s just too early. As I said, results are great but as it stands there is no precedent with this man at the helm to suggest it will continue or imminently go up in flames. It’s the start of a new relationship after a sad but probably necessary break up with a significant love. Things are currently going great and we’re enjoying this period for what it is, no need to label it.
If it sours, and statistically most do, then it does and we move on. If the current foundations lead to something more permanent though……..
Hope this answers the question Garey.
Andy, London (via everywhere)
…I understand that Garey will need new material now that his steadfast (and in no way insane) defence of ETH is no longer relevant.
However, nobody is crowning Liverpool, Garey, you know this. You can point to a few crazy people in the comments, or mentalists on Twitter (F**k you Musk, X my arse.).
I, like many other LFC fans, are rearranging our hopes from ‘Not falling apart’ to potential top four this year. We’re happy with the facts we have atm too, I’ll share mine as you shared yours.
Top of the PL and the silly new CL.
So, with that in mind, top four is definitely within our grasp.
Utd, under your beloved ETH, are in a 12th or 13th? Didn’t check.
Try harder, Vance, I know you can do better.
David (World War 3 will ensure we never see Utd winning the league again, every cloud etc) Molby, Shrewsbury
…Perhaps the reason that people think a mailboxer such as Garey Vance is not real, is that he appears to inhabit a world of make-believe.
According to Garey “There is some premature celebrating going on in Merseyside” and Liverpool fans think “Slot is the new messiah.” The problem with that is that it’s not true. I don’t know a single Liverpool fan who is confidently stating that we will win the league.
As for Slot, the consensus opinion is that he has made a great start, let’s see how it goes. No more than that. In fact looking at the mailbox and recent mails praising Liverpool and Slot the most optimistic mails were:
“In truth I don’t think we will win (the league).”
and
“While it doesn’t mean Liverpool will come away with any trophies this early in the season, it shows the club are on the right track.”
Calm down lads, eh? You’re getting a bit too excited. Garey (as has been shown many times) is typical of the football fans who just assumes or invents opinions from rival fans, then presents it as fact. Not just to others, but in his own head. He really believes what he is saying to be true and no facts or evidence presented to him will get him to change his mind. In fact I fully expect a reply in the next mailbox where Garey says, “Yeah, but I know this Liverpool fan and says they will definitely win the league. No, you don’t know him, he goes to a different school.”
The one point he is correct on is that Liverpool fans are happy. And why not? One bad result all season, top of the league, top of the Champions League big table thingy. They are very clearly, at the moment, in a title race. The bookies have Man City as favourites at 14/8. Liverpool are 15/8. We’re obviously involved in the conversation. Which is nice. But of course as a modern football fan, you are not actually allowed to celebrate anything, lest the celebration police get on your case.
One final point, and this is very Garey, but does he really think that booking a victory parade bus is evidence of a club assuming they will win? Can I ask him what he thinks other clubs do? Does he actually believe that they wait until the final whistle, then start scrambling around: “DOES ANYONE KNOW WHERE WE CAN GET AN OPEN TOP BUS AT 24 HOURS NOTICE?!” Again, very Garey, but he is someone who takes a perfectly normal action (booking a bus in case you win a title) and then uses this as evidence that Liverpool are arrogant, entitled and assume they will win everything.
So, to be clear. None of us are confident we will win the league, the vast majority think we won’t win the league, we like (but don’t yet love) Arne Slot but in general are pretty happy with how the season is going. No more than that.
Mike, LFC, Dubai
…What the actual hell is Garey Vance on about?
Real though he may be… his opinions are still made up surely.
“We’re only 10 games in and already the Liverpool fans are talking of titles and how Slot is the new messiah.”
Who are these fans and where did you hear them?
I am not on any social media so I can’t comment on those crazy people that are.
I had a mail published only yesterday that was saying how quietly Arne has gone about this and how no one is really talking about Slot or Liverpool being serious contenders.. Imagine if this was Xabi, then yes the (media and Liverpool fans) world would have lost its collective mind.
Go back to the mirror Garey and take a long look at your self and decide if you are actually real or not.
Luckily before you have your new man in place he has ALREADY been decried as the new Messiah/Fergie (watch today at the massive over reaction to the win against City last night). Might even already be here – I haven’t got past your opening mailbox entry yet..
Good luck with the crazies
May you not quite escape the relegation battle you find yourselves in… and May Rubin help you out of the Champo.
Al – LFC – Bewildered by fake news and narratives
MORE LIVERPOOL COVERAGE ON F365…
👉 This Liverpool ‘not as dangerous’; surely their ‘luck’ cannot last under Arne Slot?
👉 Liverpool nepotism eroding as Slot earns Alonso scalp with dream debut season gathering steam
👉 Liverpool star’s ‘transfer date set’ by ‘most likely’ next club making ‘big push’ amid new ‘change’
Liverpool ARE defensively better
Garey Vance listed out eight sets of stats from Slot’s first 10 league games in charge, asking “what has changed tactically?” One of the stats is that Liverpool now concede an average of 0.6 goals per game instead of 1.1 goals per game. Isn’t that the answer to your question, Garey? (I’m not going to dispute the rest of his silly mail, it’s not worthy of a response).
Nonetheless, I agree that it would be interesting to find someone who watches enough Liverpool matches under Slot + Klopp, and understands/pays enough attention to football tactics, to try to really understand what has been changed. Pundits resort to talking about “heavy metal football” vs “more controlled” because they aren’t able to put their fingers on anything specific.
I am not a tactical expert, I can only say that I watch every game.
In possession, I have noticed that there is a pattern of play that Slot’s Liverpool repeatedly use that we rarely saw under Klopp: LFC holds possession deep in their own half, gets it to the fullback, and plays the ball ‘blindly’ up the wing in the direction of the winger, who knows that pass is coming and is already moving to get on the end of it.
We have also seen midfielders make driving runs in possession more frequently under Slot (Gravenberch obviously, but others too). I don’t have any specific observations about changes in how LFC plays out of possession, but likely there are subtle differences in when/how the press is triggered, how high the line is, etc. One thing is obvious: Slot puts more of an emphasis on winning physical 1:1 challenges than Klopp did, hence removing Quansah at half-time from the first league match and sticking with Konate.
Oliver Dziggel, Geneva Switzerland
Success needs luck
Garey (the real slim shady) Vance, MUFC wrote in the morning mailbox citing examples about the majority of Liverpool wins this season are down to ‘luck’ or due to the opposition being wasteful.
Success in competitive team sports is highly driven by the elements of luck and skill, and football is the biggest example of it. (if you need stats driven by research, there are tons of dissertations on the role of luck in football success – knock yourselves out :)). Success in the short term is usually more skewed towards the good luck factor, whereas longer term success will be skewed towards skill, and together they make teams win the big leagues.
John Stones clearing the ball off the line from 11mm off is due to both a big desire and skill, and a big chunk of luck involved, and was the difference between Liverpool going 71 games unbeaten back-to-back league winners.
While I do agree that Brighton could have been 3-0 up by halftime, they didn’t, whereas in the 2nd half they were completely outperformed by Liverpool. A new manager trying to find success in the first big games against Chelsea and Arsenal can make some judgement calls such as to sit back, however there are games every week in every league where teams fight to win a game when they may create fewer chances. That doesn’t imply a lack of tactical skill.
If the cries are of Arsenal being injury-stricken, surely we should keep crying a bit more about being unlucky at missing our first choice keeper and centre forward for the past month. And just because the wins against Palace and Wolves were ‘narrow’, it doesn’t mean that the games were close. Football is not a game where tennis or cricket-like scores apply, and most games usually finish narrow.
Finally, Garey requests us to use stats to counter his points. My argument to that is stats can be misleading depending upon how a user perceives it. Andre Onana (and Man Utd) have the second most clean sheets this season in the league (4), but only a one-eyed (metaphorical) United fan would suggest they have been the 2nd best defence in the league this season.
Hugo
Pet hate/rant regarding ‘Trent’
Why does every commentator insist on calling him ‘Trent Alexander-Arnold’ at every single opportunity?! Or if not that, then the even more ridiculous ‘Trent’ like he’s their mate from school?! It’s absolutely infuriating and simply emphases what a media darling he is when they ignore all objectivity around him.
Last night there must have been about 15-20 examples of using his full name for no clear reason, only to then switch to bestie Trent for a bit of variety. Not once do they comment on ‘Andy’ at the other side of the pitch.
Why!? People don’t they randomly commentate on Villa with “oh great finish from Ollie there…Ollie and big Jono combining to create a chance”
Unless I am missing something and the commentators do often refer to ‘Konstantinos Mavropaos’ or ‘Dominic Calvert Lewin’, playing against their bezzie mate ‘Marcus’ week in, week out? On the odd occasion they do full name people, it’s usually at a moment of excitement, or pivotal moment in a game – Kalvin Phillips being sent off for example. But with TAA, it’s literally every time he has the ball, moves slightly to his right, or just simply exists in camera shot.
To me, he’s a fantastic player and amazing passer of the ball, but just shy of world class due to his inability to actually defend. So yes, he’s brilliant, but why with the name thing?! I know he’s feted like he’s the second coming of Cafu, but that is just plain annoying.
Rant over.
Ossett Terrier – I promise we’re not as bad as Tamworth made us look…
On F365 characters
Whatever happened to Conor Byrne? Thought he’d have been heard from with Villa’s last few results.
Rhysie
…Must confess that I have long thought Stewie was a Football365 staffer being paid to boil Arsenal fans piss, and I admit that I don’t bother reading his tripe anymore because basically it’s regurgitated waffle with the odd valid point reworded a dozen different times.
However, after reading The Admin @ At the bridge pod calling him an obvious club ambassador, I had to respond, Ambassadors are usually a representative of the club, they don’t spend their time waiting for opportunities to run them down. Also, has he ever said he supports Arsenal? I don’t think so, and if he has and does, I wonder, has he ever been happy?
Andrew Goonerabroad Brown
(He was very obviously an Arsenal fan a long time ago, but there has been a morphing into the Stewie we see today – Ed)
